Which soldering iron?

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1024MAK
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby 1024MAK » Thu Nov 23, 2017 10:58 am

Oh, and why does every thread about soldering wander off topic and then occasionally pop back on topic!
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vanpeebles
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby vanpeebles » Thu Nov 23, 2017 11:01 am

Hehe well it does involve soldering :D

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1024MAK
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby 1024MAK » Thu Nov 23, 2017 11:04 am

vanpeebles wrote:
1024MAK wrote:
vanpeebles wrote:Ordered a small kit of that :) The resistor is for the little board on here:

https://nfggames.com/nfg/x68repair/

This is what I ordered

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2W-4-7K-ohm-C ... 2749.l2649

A resistor with a 0.25W/250mW (1/4W) or a 0.5W/500mW (1/2W) or a 0.6W/600mW power rating, all either carbon film or metal film would do. The tolerance can be anything between 1% and 5%.

For example, a search on the CPC web site gives these results.

Mark


What about the one I ordered? :)
Yeah, electrically that will work. It will never not much chance it will overheat or burn out. Bit as per the description, it's "Chunky". Fine if screwing into a screw terminal block. But a bit large if fitting on a PCB or strip board or matrix board.

Mark
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vanpeebles
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby vanpeebles » Thu Nov 23, 2017 11:12 am

It's to go on a veroboard. To cut a long story short I recently got a x68000 with one fitted that works fine. I got another x68000, which is faulty and I'm hoping to get it working by replacing the PSU with a modern one, and duplicating the circuit as fitted to the other one.

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1024MAK
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby 1024MAK » Thu Nov 23, 2017 11:15 am

Well, if you want a single 250mW 4.7k resistor, I can send one to you for the cost of a second class stamp.

Mark
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Lardo Boffin
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby Lardo Boffin » Thu Nov 23, 2017 12:47 pm

1024MAK wrote:
Lardo Boffin wrote:
sirmorris wrote:Rosin vapour condenses back into solid rosin inside your lungs, and doesn't come out.


:shock: :shock: :shock:

Neither does stone dust particles, and apparently, now carbon fibre dust is thought to be a problem.
And it's been recommended for many years now, that you try not to inhale the fumes during soldering. I don't use a filter, but do use a 12V PC type fan (ran at 9V DC to keep the noise level low) in a plastic box to draw the fumes away from me. Otherwise they are drawn towards you due to your own breathing.

Mark


Not having a ‘work station’ I use the kitchen (and there are absolutely no burn marks on the work surface whatsoever [-X ) and have the extractor fan going. Seems to work pretty well but I may add a small fan to the mix.
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danielj
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby danielj » Thu Nov 23, 2017 12:51 pm

I have one of these: http://cpc.farnell.com/duratool/d00374/ ... dp/SD01238 but they seem to have gone up in price by about £20 :?

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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby cmorley » Thu Nov 23, 2017 1:13 pm

danielj wrote:I have one of these: http://cpc.farnell.com/duratool/d00374/ ... dp/SD01238 but they seem to have gone up in price by about £20 :?


They are £5 cheaper from Rapid.
https://www.rapidonline.com/anvil-av-ext-fume-extractor-esd-85-5920

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sirmorris
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby sirmorris » Thu Nov 23, 2017 2:55 pm

Prime wrote:
sirmorris wrote:I now use a Weller liquid flux


You have a link for that Charlie?


Indeed I do.

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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby danielj » Thu Nov 23, 2017 3:00 pm

sirmorris wrote:
Indeed I do.


Just looking at the material data sheet for that, it's rosin free and looks unlikely to be utterly awful for you ;)

d.

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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby sirmorris » Thu Nov 23, 2017 3:12 pm

Haha actually it's disgusting stuff but I have a good fan ;) Colophony == Rosin.

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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby Prime » Thu Nov 23, 2017 3:27 pm

danielj wrote:
sirmorris wrote:
Indeed I do.


Just looking at the material data sheet for that, it's rosin free and looks unlikely to be utterly awful for you ;)

Yep if I was reading it right it was 75%-85% Iso-propanol anyway....I have a 200ml bottle of that on my bench in any case. Basicly, don't drink it, don't bath your eyes in it and don't smoke it...... and you should be OK.

Cheers.

Phill.

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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby danielj » Thu Nov 23, 2017 3:31 pm

sirmorris wrote:Haha actually it's disgusting stuff but I have a good fan ;) Colophony == Rosin.


I read that as colonoscopy :oops:

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jonb
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby jonb » Fri Nov 24, 2017 9:38 am

1024MAK wrote:
Lardo Boffin wrote:
sirmorris wrote:Rosin vapour condenses back into solid rosin inside your lungs, and doesn't come out.


:shock: :shock: :shock:

Neither does stone dust particles, and apparently, now carbon fibre dust is thought to be a problem.
And it's been recommended for many years now, that you try not to inhale the fumes during soldering. I don't use a filter, but do use a 12V PC type fan (ran at 9V DC to keep the noise level low) in a plastic box to draw the fumes away from me. Otherwise they are drawn towards you due to your own breathing.

Mark


Oh that is nasty. Made worse by the sweet smell of rosin. As a kid I used to love the small of the solder. Now, when I am soldering I have the magnifying lamp between me and the board so my nose is shielded from the fumes, sort of. Not as good as proper extraction, though!

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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby danielj » Fri Nov 24, 2017 10:15 am

I find myself gently blowing as I solder... Even with the extraction.

d.

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tautology
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby tautology » Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:29 pm

At work we have use a Metcal soldering station (near £200) which is really easy to use, especially for SMD work and tacking wires to debug pads.

At home I generally use a cheap Chinese station, which I think I was lucky on getting a decent one (IIRC it was around the £50 mark).

In my hardware toolkit (used for travelling) I have a USB powered soldering iron (about £10), which is surprisingly not rubbish. But it needs a decent 2A USB feed and wasn't good enough for SMD work, so I try and only use it for through hole.

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Lardo Boffin
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby Lardo Boffin » Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:32 pm

My XS25 arrived and I have just recapped a toastrack Spectrum 128k. Its fair to say that the new soldering iron is significantly better than my old one! :D .Thanks for the suggestion!
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crj
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby crj » Wed Nov 29, 2017 12:03 am

Hmm. I just followed the link for the XS25 and thought "that looks familiar".

I've checked and my trusty old soldering iron that I've had for well over 25 years is an Antex "XS", rated at a voltage-dependent 21-24W. I don't suppose anyone's been following Antex products carefully enough over the past quarter century that they know how different a modern XS25 would be?

Meanwhile, having used one at a former employer, I can vouch for the loveliness of Metcal soldering stations. You can feel the way the iron remains at a relatively low temperature but responsively dumps thermal energy into whatever it touches.

Where does Hakko sit on the Antex-Metcal line? I'm wondering how much I need to spend to get a useful improvement. Or whether I should just stop blaming my tools and practice more.

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jonb
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby jonb » Wed Nov 29, 2017 8:08 am

The Hakko is the one people seem to rave on about most of the time. It's a proper temperature controlled soldering station. I do have an old Antex iron, I think it's 15W and mains powered but it's in the garage right now - has been since the Hakko arrived. They are like chalk and cheese. The Metcal station looks very similar to the Hakko (in terms of size, features; obviously the Hakko's got a funky blue & yellow colour scheme that makes it look rather toy-like). They (Metcal PS900 and Hakko FX888) both have digital temperature control and I guess similar fast heatup / recovery times. The Hakko can memorise 5 different temperature settings as well, which may be useful depending on your usage patterns (I just keep mine at 350C).

I doubt anyone buying a Hakko has ever had cause to regret it. I know I haven't.

Don't overlook the importance of solder quality. I currently use Kester solder, it is NOS and lead / tin with an internal rosin core. I also have some el-cheapo eBay rubbish, which is not lead based and may or may not have flux (might be coated instead of cored). This stuff is CRAP, it does not flow well and joints look dull, even with the Hakko. I kept it, because it cost money, but I do not use it. Maybe in an emergency! On the other hand, the Kester stuff flows beautifully and sets shiny.

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vanpeebles
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby vanpeebles » Wed Nov 29, 2017 8:36 am

I did a load of soldering last night with the Hakko, and it's a joy. It just stays hot but never burns, it's ideal for a newbie like myself. My wiring looks a bit rough and ready, just needs testing now :lol:

Also the Hakko is great because it has little cartoons on their website.

http://www.hakko.com/english/hikaru/pages/

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sirmorris
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby sirmorris » Wed Nov 29, 2017 12:47 pm

"Mr.Yokoo: Soldering irons will not disappear as long as there are people like you interested in electronic handicrafts.
Hikaru : Yes, indeed. We cannot install a reflow machine in our home.
Mr.Yokoo: That's right. Ha-ha-ha-ha (Laughing)"

=D>

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vanpeebles
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby vanpeebles » Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:44 pm

Hehehe, I also like:

Hikaru: I'm a working member of society starting today. I feel the pressure. I'm the only new employee here? I wonder if I will have an opportunity to have a party with new women employees?

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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby crj » Wed Nov 29, 2017 6:53 pm

jonb wrote:the Hakko's got a funky blue & yellow colour scheme that makes it look rather toy-like)

Also available in silver!

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danielj
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby danielj » Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:20 pm

So, I just tried drag soldering some smallymouse TQFPs with my hakko and the C2 tip, something that I've not actually done in anger before - it worked like it does in the videos, I was mightily impressed.

d.

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tautology
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby tautology » Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:13 pm

jonb wrote:Don't overlook the importance of solder quality. I currently use Kester solder, it is NOS and lead / tin with an internal rosin core. I also have some el-cheapo eBay rubbish, which is not lead based and may or may not have flux (might be coated instead of cored). This stuff is CRAP, it does not flow well and joints look dull, even with the Hakko. I kept it, because it cost money, but I do not use it. Maybe in an emergency! On the other hand, the Kester stuff flows beautifully and sets shiny.


I 100% agree with this - about 6 months ago I discovered that the reason I was having problems soldering stuff wasn't my uselessness or a bad iron - it was because I was using cheap solder.

A few quid from farnell for a roll of decent solder and suddenly I could solder, even SMD. (Though I had to buy a magnifying loom to do it effectively.)

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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby Prime » Thu Nov 30, 2017 7:30 am

crj wrote:
jonb wrote:the Hakko's got a funky blue & yellow colour scheme that makes it look rather toy-like)

Also available in silver!


I actually like the blue and yellow, I think the silver one looks a little bland to be honest.

Cheers.

Phill.

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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby Prime » Thu Nov 30, 2017 7:35 am

danielj wrote:So, I just tried drag soldering some smallymouse TQFPs with my hakko and the C2 tip, something that I've not actually done in anger before - it worked like it does in the videos, I was mightily impressed.


Not my experience alas I got myself a C3 bit as Charlie suggested but all I succeded in doing was getting solder everywhere I didn't want and not where I did. I can't really understand how you could use such a big bit for anything presise.

I guess I'm doing something wrong or iron too hot or something but just can't get it to work.

Cheers.

Phill.

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danielj
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby danielj » Thu Nov 30, 2017 8:01 am

I was at 370, lots of low residue liquid flux (no colonoscopy in it), clean tip, nice blob of solder then quickly along the edge and it just all took neatly on each pin.

d.

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sirmorris
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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby sirmorris » Thu Nov 30, 2017 8:02 am

Too much solder perhaps? You need only the tiiiiiiiinyiest touch for a tqfp. A bit more for a sodip. And flux. Lots of it. The more toxic the better :lol: Moar colons.

I don't tack any more, i just flux up, hold the chip in the right place, touch a tiny bit of solder on the tip. With a wet the tip there's no feeding of solder as you go. The tip should hold all you need for a side.

With the flat slightly angled up toward the chip edge you pull the iron along the pins. You feel them bumping gently under the tip, but not too much.

You need the surface area of the tip to maintain a surface tension in the solder which is what provides the dragging force. You're pulling a bead along, rather than wiping solder on to the pins. It's harder to describe than I thought :(

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Re: Which soldering iron?

Postby vanpeebles » Thu Nov 30, 2017 8:36 am

I was dragging solder round like a pro on a veroboard. I didn't want to either! :oops:


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